Save Buncombe Street Legacy Testimonials

The United Methodist Church is deeply ingrained in my spiritual life. I first attended Shandon United Methodist Church in Columbia, where Rev. John Miller was youth pastor and Bryan Crenshaw was senior minister. I enjoyed several summers at Asbury Hills Camp and Retreat Center. When I moved to Greenville in the early 1980s, my family attended Northside United Methodist Church during Will Willimon’s time as minister, and then during the past 20 years, I have been a member at Buncombe Street United Methodist Church, where Rev. John Miller baptized my oldest grandchild -- coming full circle back to one of my most influential pastoral connections. 

The United Methodist Church has looked forward in following Christ’s teachings and not backwards, and by doing so has risen to and overcome all challenges. The Methodist Church started Epworth Children’s Home and Spartanburg Methodist College, among many other institutions for which we should be proud. These institutions not only need but deserve our support to continue as United Methodist institutions. To splinter the United Methodist Church would be to the detriment of those institutions and the people they serve since they would lose revenue from our apportionments – with Buncombe Street being one of the most important in its financial contributions. 

I can speak firsthand as to Spartanburg Methodist College, as I chaired the Board of Trustees with my term ending this past May, and I continue to serve as a trustee. SMC changes lives of families by providing an education in the Christian tradition for those who cannot afford one. These students often hold down two part-time jobs to meet their expenses. From its beginnings 100 years ago, when Rev. David Camak, a Methodist minister, saw the need for an education for people leaving farms to work in the textile mill, to the present, Buncombe Street UMC plays a key role in enabling students to continue their education and to provide a pathway out of poverty for generations. 

The United Methodist Church has weathered many storms from the time in the 1840s, when my great great grandfather, Rev. Lewis Crum, was a plantation missionary in the Orangeburg District, to the present when we each must make a decision. Although there have been congregational challenges – even more disruptive than the present one, in my opinion --  the United Methodist Church has worked through these challenges and always ended united – and on the side of what the best of Christianity teaches us. 

I believe in the United Methodist Church as the way forward.

Back to top

  In the Summer of 1984 Renee and I were living in Chapel   Hill, NC, and were members of University UMC. Renee and the kids were having a great time. I, on the other hand, was living hard as the first utility manager, an NCSU graduate, to invade Tar Heel country. When Duke Power offered the opportunity to move to Greenville, SC, I jumped at it. 

As the son of a UMC minister, I had been a member of many UMC churches. I found my future bride at Lowes UMC in Reidsville,  NC, the last of Dad’s charges before I headed off to college. He had moved on, but came back and married us in 1967 at Lowes.           Renee had been a member of Lowes all her life. She quickly learned that being married to a Duke Power manager was similar to being a minister’s wife. We moved every 4 years. 

We started our family in 1969 when son John was born in Winston Salem. Anna came along in 1972, just in time for the move to Charlotte. Next was Eden, NC, in 1976, and Chapel Hill in 1980. In each of these communities we found and joined United Methodist Churches. 

With the move to Greenville, things changed in a big way. Buncombe Street UMC found us and we stopped moving around. When word got out at University UMC that we were moving to Greenville, the associate minister collared John and Anna and told them that his best friend in the world was an associate minister at Buncombe Street UMC. He said he had already told Bob Howell  we were coming. The welcoming legacy of Buncombe Street was already working. The kids were already adopted before the adults even thought about a church.

We have been members for 38 years, and Buncombe   Street and the United Methodist Church have always lived up to our expectations and needs. It's been painful and disappointing to listen to the concerns expressed by friends and fellow members this summer. We've heard the arguments, and simply don't agree that they support the uncertainty and risk of disaffiliation. We're not going anywhere, and we fully expect the BSUMC Legacy to continue.

Back to top

When my wife and I felt it was time to change churches, we planned to visit numerous area churches and to choose the one that was the right fit for our family. We visited Buncombe   Street first because we had numerous friends who were members. When we got in the car after our first visit, our oldest son asked when we could go back. We never visited another church. 

Pam and I were sold on the children’s programs that Buncombe Street offered and were aware of the missions and outreach that the Methodist church supports. As new members, we attended an outreach meeting and were so inspired that we agreed to chair and start the Interfaith Hospitality Network at Buncombe Street. Leading such a committee, combined with the outreach from the children’s and youth ministries as well as the basketball teams, formed a mindset of service and compassion for each of our sons. 

Alexander and Carter enjoyed their church camp experiences so much that they volunteered as counselors at Camp Moseley through high school, and they participated in Walk With Christ ensure that other youth had similar meaningful experiences. The value of service that Buncombe Street instilled in them led both boys to mission trips in Peru. Carter participated on a medical mission trip down the Amazon  River, stopping at villages to provide healthcare and social interaction. In 2021, he volunteered for two weeks in Ecuador followed by a month in Peru. 

When Buncombe   Street offered a mission trip to the Ecuador jungle this year, where we would teach the children how to play basketball, it seemed like the perfect fit for Pam and me. Our sons started playing basketball in the Bring a Buddy league at Buncombe   Street and continued playing through college. We felt called to go on a mission trip and we love basketball. Seeing over 60 children participating in basketball drills that first afternoon fulfilled my expectations. Witnessing mothers peeling paint with machetes while having children strapped to their midsection reminded us of our many blessings. I enjoyed watching our young people interact with the native children. We worked hard, but we got to see a beautiful country and we formed lasting friendships with members of our church. 

We are thankful for the values that Buncombe Street instilled in our sons. Their exposure to Methodist beliefs has given them the humility to serve others and confidence in their faith. We don't see those values changing, so we support Buncombe   Street remaining in the United Methodist Church. Pam and I are proud to have learned from our sons! 

Back to top

Although we have not been members for almost 25 years since we moved away, I want to voice my support for your efforts. 

When we moved back to the Greenville area a few years ago we of course visited BSUMC assuming that we would be rejoining.  Then covid struck so no church for a while.  Once we started looking again, I was turned off by the “friends” and how they are actively working to keep an entire community of people out of the full life of the church. To me this is not biblical, it is no less than sinful, and a direct violation of The Great Commission. "Therefore, go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely, I am with you always, to the very end of the age. “(Mat 28 19-20) 

I notice here He tells us to make disciples of ALL nations, teaching them to obey EVERYTHING that He commanded (which never included the first word about LGBTQ issues). 

We have since become active in a church other than the one I started going to in 1973, got confirmed in, and was married in.  Not coming back to BSUMC was not what I expected. 

During our time away we were active in UMC churches in every place we lived.  In that time we had the privilege to know some people that the “friends” seek to exclude from the full life of the church.  In these churches there were no pride flags or drag queens preaching, the church did not focus or talk about LGBTQ issues or ignore the message of the Gospel.  Some of these churches looked a lot like BSUMC.  These were normal run of the mill UMCs in South Carolina.   

I am certainly no left wing progressive but I cannot see how an informed view of scripture backs the intentional keeping of any group of people away from Jesus...especially considering:

• All of the questions surrounding      the interpretation from the original Greek and Hebrew for some      verses and mis-application of other verses taken out of context.
• The lack of any condemnation from Jesus himself for LGBTQ      people.
• The emphasis placed paying attention to the plank in MY eye      and not the speck in YOURS.
• My understanding that the blood of Christ can cover any      and all sin, even mine.  Therefore, I don’t need to worry about      anyone else’s perceived sin.

I hope that BSUMC chooses the side of compassion and love.  Good luck in your efforts.

Back to top

Forty years ago I mounted dozens of steps to enter Buncombe Street United Methodist Church for the first time. Having recently moved to Greenville to teach at Furman University and feeling a bit lonely, I was eager to find a church home. As I glanced at the reflection piece on the front page of the bulletin, I read, “Henry James said the most beautiful word in the English language is ‘twilight.’” Having spent three years researching and writing a 500-page dissertation on Henry James’s interest in art, I took that sentence as a sign from God that I was in the right place—and continue to feel that way forty years later. 

I have read messages saying that our church is broken and in decline and departing from our “traditionalist” identity. In contrast, I see a forward-looking church whose traditions include embracing change to follow Christ. Shortly after becoming a church member in 1982, I joined the Missions and Outreach Commission. At our committee meetings, I met four on-fire-with-Christianity women who enthusiastically left their comfort zones: Roberta Ogle, Eva Troutman, Nan Ivester, and Nell Culpepper. These inspiring women in the Wesleyan tradition plunged into any opportunity to share their practical theology—from securing furniture for those recently leaving incarceration, to preparing a simple meal to educate the congregation on hunger needs around the world, to starting Happy Days Camp. Their legacy continues as later generations of their families attend Buncombe Street. 

In 1986 Reverend Luonne Rouse was appointed to serve Buncombe Street UMC—the first cross-racial appointment in South Carolina Methodism since Reconstruction. Some who couldn’t break with the tradition of having a white minister left the church, but most welcomed Reverend Rouse and his family and appreciated his leading the church to expand its outreach ministries to focus on the basic needs of the unemployed, the elderly, the homeless, the addicted, those suffering from mental illness and HIV/AIDS, and others who were marginalized. 

 In 1997 Reverend Susan Leonard Ray was appointed as Associate Pastor at Buncombe Street. Some could not condone having a female pastor. (After all, Paul wrote, “As in all the churches of the saints, 34 the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. 35 And if they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church” 1 Corinthians 34-35). These individuals, who felt they were following tradition, left the church, but the vast majority celebrated their new minister’s spiritual gifts and leadership, which included starting contemporary worship at Buncombe Street.

My family’s spiritual growth was further enhanced by Reverend Gayle Quay, another trailblazer who served as Minister of Children at Buncombe Street for almost three decades. Wanting to teach children to directly apply Bible study to social ministry, Gayle started the innovative Pioneer Club and Sprouts programs involving children in projects for such agencies as United Ministries, Safe Harbor, and Samaritan’s Purse as they focus on acts of compassion, justice, worship, and devotion. With Reverend Jerry Hill, Pastor of Missions and Outreach at Buncombe Street for 17 years, I participated in Feeding Jesus to provide bag lunches and sometimes warm clothing to those seeking day labor.  Out on the streets of Greenville in the early morning, Rev. Hill taught my young daughter and me how to treat people in adverse circumstances as if they were Jesus.  

Through the years I’ve seen our church step out on faith to undertake new endeavors— sponsoring the second Habitat House built in Greenville, in 2001 being one of the first churches to join the Greenville Interfaith Hospitality Network to house and support homeless families, launching Circles Upstate SC with SHARE in 2015 to help families emerge from poverty, offering support to Triune Mercy Center so that it could gain stability as a non-denominational mission church, and establishing Trinity United Methodist Church as a satellite campus. I think Buncombe Street deserves its reputation throughout Greenville as a welcoming Christian community that willingly accepts new challenges and lovingly helps those in need.

Then I become one of those most in need when my husband’s heart valve replacement surgery went awry due to surgical error, and he was left fighting for his life during the subsequent five emergency surgeries within six days, followed by three months in the hospital, most of which was in ICU. During that time my spiritual needs were met by our ministerial staff, particularly Rev. Putnam. My wonderful Sunday School class assisted with my daily needs, and even people in the congregation I did not know sustained me through prayer.

Each Sunday I eagerly attend worship (sometimes the traditional service, sometimes The Table) and a Sunday School class with members—of varied ages, political affiliations, and ideas but united in our fondness for and commitment to each other. At Buncombe Street I have developed relationships with individuals who have had experiences outside my rather limited middle-class existence—such as being incarcerated, addicted to drugs, sleeping in the woods or cars. They have revealed to me a tested and victorious faith that strengthens my own. I am heartsick that some in our congregation believe we cannot continue to be united in the same denomination with our brothers and sisters in Christ—many of whom I have worshipped with for decades.

Recently I have felt the joy of worshipping as one body at Pentecost and World Communion Sundays, of celebrating Missions Impact Weekend, and of participating in two small groups enabling me to develop meaningful relationships with some church members I did not know before—one illuminating our Methodist heritage and the other studying how to dismantle racism and create “God’s Dream.” In Buncombe Street United Methodist Church, I have found love, inclusiveness, boundless compassion, spiritual illumination, and connectedness within our congregation and the broader UMC church. May those traditions continue to thrive!

Back to top

I have been a life-long Methodist. The United Methodist Church has always been to me an example of inclusiveness, freedom of thought, and open discussion of the scriptures. For those who were brought up in other denominations, such as Baptist, Church of God, etc., the fact that people can disagree on what scriptures mean and still lovingly co-exist, may seem foreign. Methodists do not dictate what people should think and throw people out if they disagree.

I am a daughter of an ordained Elder and have seen the benefits of inclusion, pastoral itinerancy and connectedness through apportionments. Here are examples of my experience being a “preacher’s kid.”

My dad was a pastor of a “large” country church with a membership of around 200. It was situated on a major highway of our county near Kentucky Lake. As a result, we had lots of traffic passing by our church and parsonage. This was in the early ‘60s and the county’s population was all white. One Sunday morning during worship a black family traveling through the area stopped and asked if they could worship with us. They were welcomed and they celebrated communion with us. This inclusion was something very rare for that time and made a BIG impression on me and my young friends. I’m sure had the people been gay, my father and the congregation would have welcomed them as well – without judgment! 

My father had several appointments, some of which were multiple-church charges. These churches were tiny and were often paired with the “large” ones. (Remember, I classified the 200-member church as “large”.) There was no way these tiny churches could pay a salary of a minister on their own. Even one three-church charge often relied on even larger churches’ apportionments to remain open. Closing these churches would have been a disservice to the communities and to the mission of the denomination as a whole. These churches were the lifeblood of their communities. We need those little churches! It is incumbent on the rich churches like Buncombe Street to help them out. People say that they want their money go to missions. If this isn’t considered missions, I don’t know what is.

I have seen firsthand the benefits of pastoral itinerancy even though at the time, “moving again” was always said with a groan. (There are some benefits to always being the new kid, however.) My dad had a knack for heading up major building campaigns. As a result, the bishop was always willing to send him to a charge where they wanted/needed new facilities, mostly new sanctuaries. At one appointment, the church was meeting in a storefront. By the time we moved, they had a beautiful new sanctuary and education building. On the flip side, I have noticed as a regular member (not the preacher’s kid) that it seems when a church is in trouble or getting stagnant, a new appointment can, and often does, revitalize the church. You can’t get that when you hire only like-minded people who stay years on end.

My family and I moved to Greenville in 1988. We were drawn to Buncombe Street because of its similarity to our previous large church in Cincinnati , and Miles and I were immediately welcomed into the Seekers Sunday School Class. Two of our children were confirmed here. They played basketball and were active in the youth activities. I was grateful for the help in teaching my children how to be good people and to learn how to be responsible Christians. When we had to move away for 9 years, we kept in touch with our BSUMC friends and returned to attend Seekers’ Retreats seven of those years. I have been in the choir for a combination of 26 years. I love this church! I, however will NOT relinquish my membership in the United Methodist Church. If Buncombe Street votes to disaffiliate from the UMC, I will find a church that will be accepting of others, takes care of its pastors and small churches, and gets a fresh perspective from a new pastor when it’s needed.

I will stay a United Methodist until I die.

Back to top

Stay with Grace and Love 

My prayer for this great church is for all of us to stay together and to love each other through our theological differences, but that seems a dream at this point. While I do have Christ's love in my heart for everyone, I disagree with those who want to leave the United Methodist Church and the connectionalism that links Buncombe Street UMC to millions of United Methodists all over the world and the amazing work that the Church does in the name of Jesus the Christ. 

Although my membership is at Christ Episcopal Church, I grew up in the Baptist church. But even as a child, I disagreed with the vehement judgment that I often heard coming from the pulpit. What struck me then as now is the degree to which professing Christians can grade one sin over the other, placing them in various categories of acceptance (sins that we can live with or understand) or anathema (sins that we can't live with or don’t understand) and failing to recognize that ALL sin goes against God's great purpose for His children. 

I've been a church musician for 43 years and have served nine churches over the course of that time - most of them United Methodist churches. As is the case in the Episcopal Church, I've found the UMC to be a place where people of varying theological perspectives can come together and discuss their faith and ideas openly and civilly - and yes - love each other through those differences. 

I've had the pleasure of serving the people here at Buncombe Street UMC for almost 15 years now. And until about a year ago, I assumed that this church was like other UMC churches in which I've served. I've been proven wrong. Sadly, I've been witness to the kind of vitriol and cunning that I was exposed to from years in the Baptist church - the heavy use of fear appeals, and in some cases, stretched truths told to further an agenda. Those leading the charge to leave the UMC didn't just spring up overnight. But the tactics used by some from this group (I'm very glad that I don't know who) over the past few weeks have left me utterly bereft: a deliberate attempt to impugn an ordained minister of the Gospel of Christ through a fraudulent appeal is a first for me. In all of my years in church work, I've now seen a new low. Add to this a blatant disgregard of our Senior Minister's urging to stop all formal email communication from both the Friends and Legacy groups. Since Rev. Gilmer's request just eight days ago, the Friends group continues its relentless pursuit to divide the people of this incredible church of almost two centuries by sending two additional electronic and card mailings. 

I've even had my Christianity called into question as unbiblical. Anyone who knows me knows that I cherish my relationship with God above all else. This sinner condemned unclean is made new day by day by God's redeeming grace and mercy, and I'm so thankful. 

Again and sadly, I well recognize the archetype of Christianity at work here. I keep hearing much bantered about, but one of them is that we want to make sure that the "real" Bible is preached here. By virtue of what I do, I can tell you that I've probably listened to more sermons preached by all clergy more than even the most well attended parishioner. In 15 years of sermons at services, confirmations, funerals, weddings, special services, I have never - not once - heard anything but the authentic Word of God and Message of the Gospel preached at the lectern - all in accordance with the Book of Worship and the Book of Discipline. 

So instead of discussing differences of ideology and opinion openly and honestly and with love that is a hallmark of Methodism, a small group of folks has taken on the task of making certain that Buncombe Street is preserved in the correct way - their way. And the rest of us who disagree with them simply don't matter, because we are obviously on the wrong side of Jesus. I don't think so. 

The truth of the matter is this, my friends. Drawing a line in the sand for disaffiliation will have unintended consequences for the cause of Christ in this community and beyond. Our greatest commandment given to us by Our Lord and Savior is to love one another as He loves us. I don't know about you, but that is radical love at work, for no one loves us more than Jesus. 

Right now, I see Buncombe Street UMC as neighbors in our community do - a warm, welcoming church seeking to accept all of God's children wherever they are in their faith journey irrespective of their background. But if they are successful, that perception becomes a new reality that moves from inclusion to exclusion. That can never be good when trying to fulfill our purpose as Christians. 

We have to meet folks where they are and love and nurture them to fulfill their work to build God's Kingdom here on earth. In one fell swoop, it is possible to undo almost two centuries of missional work and testimony. I pray that doesn't happen. It just doesn't make sense to act now on what "might" happen when the result will divide the church and decimate its ministries. 

I've said this all along: We are Stronger Together. I have always seen our differences of opinion as a strength - iron sharpening iron. I still do. I pray daily for this church and all of its members. I pray that God will continue to give me a heart to love those with whom I disagree. But at the end of the day, the God I serve commands me to love and share the good news of His gospel with ALL - and not just those who see things my way. 

It is in His great Love that I write these thoughts and pray these prayers. May God continue to bless this church for the advancement of His greatest commandment. 

Soli Deo Gloria.

Back to top

I  walked into the Charleston District Office of the South Carolina Annual  Conference on April 1st, 2011, to learn where I was going to be  appointed in June. I was completing my fourth year in a new church  restart and felt I had to do something different. I  had celebrated amazing highs with church growth and had lamented  horrific lows in learning what it was like to secure, finance, and  maintain a building during the 2007 housing crisis. I did not know what  to think of walking in the office on April Fool's Day,  but thought...whatever, let's do it. 

When I opened the envelope and saw I was going to Greenville to be the associate at Buncombe Street, I was  completely surprised and immediately interested. I believe the cabinet  felt I needed to fill out the remaining skill  sets of church leadership, at a church that set a high standard for the  South Carolina Annual Conference. I knew how to develop an interesting  message, but could I build an interesting team? I knew how to get  families to come back the next Sunday, but could  I get them to be engaged leaders for the next twenty years? I knew how  to compel people to give, but could I surround myself with a team of  leaders that could develop and implement a legitimate giving program and  matching budget? I knew how to work with a  secretary and a handful of volunteers, but could I work with a massive  staff? 

From 2011-2015, I was given every opportunity to learn anything I  ever wanted by observing the example of gifted clergy, staff, and lay  leaders and by leading in different areas  of the church. In 2015, I went to Memorial UMC completely ready to be a  dynamic leader, because of the foresight of the Annual Conference and  the generosity of the staff and laity of Buncombe Street. 

While serving,  I heard stories of multiple Buncombe Streets  and witnessed it on a routine basis. There was the worship style in the  Sanctuary and the worship style in Sisk Hall. Some liked this minister  and others liked that minister. There were the people that loved  missions above all else and the people that loved  our sports above all else. In many cases the different priorities were  represented in the same family or across generations of a family tree.  In every case, the program, worship, mission, or sport drew people  together and invited new people in with an anchor  point to stay. I heard family members playfully and legitimately get  after each other about the different preferences and priorities the  church offered. I heard every theological stance in small groups and  Sunday school classes, in the hallways, in funerals  and weddings, and on buses to Junaluska. It was a true blessing. 

If you  follow through with division, you step away from nearly two hundred  years of problem solving and compromise. The church was founded before  the nation was torn apart by Civil War, before  it nearly tore itself apart again in the Civil Rights Movement, before  two World Wars, and before two worldwide pandemics that affected us  forever. Those leaders figured a way forward, to the point that I  witnessed all interpretations in the building as late  as 2015. 

If you follow through, you are telling a denomination that has done as much or more for social justice and missions than any  denomination in US history that you are all set and you've got it from  here. You go from multiple Buncombe Streets to just  one, training only particular ministers to say only particular things. 

I  will forever be grateful for what you did for me, nudging me back into  vital ministry in 2011. Unfortunately, this action and similar ones  across the conference were the reason I no longer  felt welcome to serve in any church in which I was appointed, and why I  chose to step away from the full time work. I love you and I wish you  grace and peace in your deliberations this year and beyond. 

Back to top

As a life-long United Methodist, I grieve the division in our beloved denomination. I do not understand the pressing urgency for a church to push for a premature decision while General Conference 2024 hasn’t even happened.

I grew up in Greenville and always viewed Buncombe Street as a pillar of Christian witness and the fertile soil that produced many leaders in the Conference and beyond. While at Furman, I saw my first female pastor, Rev. Susan Henry-Crowe, who was campus minister to the Wesley Fellowship. She sparked my call to ministry.Later as the Chaplain of Columbia College, I found Bishop Will Willimon to be a great mentor and friend. He coached me through many challenges in the ministry of higher education. Both of these remarkable leaders have roots in BSUMC. 

I recall Rev. Bryan Crenshaw, Bishop Jack Meadors and my close friend, Rev. Susan Leonard, all leaving a mark as pastors at BSUMC. This is a church that has always had room for all theological viewpoints. If we are all to see everything the same regarding even Jesus, then why did the early Christians allow 4 gospels - each with different perspectives and stories - to be included in the Bible? 

The push for a single-minded, uniform view is unrealistic and unhealthy in any community. “In essentials unity, in non-essentials liberty, in all things charity.” John Wesley 

I pray that God will bring peace and unity, in the midst of diversity, which has always been a hallmark of the UMC. 

Back to top